Will Apple Go Blue-Ray or HD DVD?
Very soon Apple will be in a bit of bind. But not to worry, it will have plenty of company. In fact, in a few years Dell, HP, Apple, Acer, Lenovo, et al will all be facing the question of which drive to put in their computers, Blue Ray or HD DVD? Now some of you might point out that Apple has already chosen sides when it picked Blue-Ray. And I would agree that it looks like Apple is leaning in that direction. But one should remember that Steve Jobs will do whatever it takes to ensure Apple’s stock continues to rise. And if that means switching horses mid-race (Intel ring a bell?), then I have no doubt that he will do it. And so, as far as I can see it there really are only three options:
1. Support No Format—Who needs a high-density disk anyway? Haven’t you heard that disks are soooo 1990’s? Its all about wireless baby!
2. Support One Format Only—I see Apple choosing this route because it tends to put the technology it wants (read Blue Ray), not always what consumers want into its machines.
3. Support Both Formats—This is a great idea, but licensing restrictions may make this illegal. Yes, I know, that sucks.
I just can’t imagine that Apple would completely forego a disk drive. Even if it turned the Mac into a wireless, iPod connected, super streaming media hub there are some things that you just need a disk for. What else would they do? Stay with CDs and DVDs while Dell is releasing HD DVD drives? No, I don’t think this will happen. The one exception being that if Apple does actually make a media hub type device that device might be spared a disk drive in favor of streaming content off of Apple’s servers, but even then it’s a long shot.
The best solution would be for either Sony or Toshiba to concede and both companies just support one format. Realistically that will never happen because both companies have invested far too much money just to give up now. And that brings us back to where we started, what will Apple do?
One course of action might be to hang back, see which format seems to gain the most ground and then support that type and hope that it works out in the end. The ultimate goal in this case would be for one format to get pummelled and slowly fade out of the picture. And assuming Apple bets on the right horse, this would be a grand solution.
But how likely is that, really? With so many high profile companies on either (and sometimes both) sides of this struggle there are plenty of ways to keep both formats alive. And what do the consumers want? After all, they will be the ones who decide which format succeeds. Which one will they value most? Lower prices (both for the media and the reader) or higher storage?
Personally, I am leaning towards the higher storage, but thats me. Because you have to assume that the price will go down as time goes on. And if, in the long run, both types of disks/players cost approximately the same then the one with the higher storage will always win. So unless there is some hidden advantage to HD DVD that I haven’t heard of yet it would seem Blue Ray will eventually come out on top. Assuming, that is, that they ever ship their players. . .
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It is most interesting though how the PS3 will tilt the equation between these competing HD disc formats. The PS3 would benefit from the extra storage space for games such as FF XIII’s huge texture maps while being able to play Blu-Ray discs to your hi-def screens.
Personally, i wouldnt pay 600 bucks for the PS3, not even when it comes with blu-ray player.
Just a bit of feedback on the links…
I actually don’t really mind the links to advertising so much. I can avoid them if I don’t feel like I have the time but if I am not 100% sure what you’re talking about I sometimes appreciate the added info. The one problem I have with it is that they are difficult to read (applies to all links). The yellow-orange text on white background is not very readable. I would suggest a dark blue or something.
But on the article, I agree with others that have said they don’t care which one wins. I want my hi-def movies at home but I’m not buying a player until someone wins so I don’t have an obsolete piece of hardware sitting under my tv.
And all the players should be universal anyway. Do Toshiba or Sony really expect someone’s grandmother to know which discs to buy or which player they have? I think that will be key.
Personally, i wouldnt pay 600 bucks for the PS3, not even when it comes with blu-ray player.-nana
I agree with your principles that $599 is stratospheric for a “game” machine. We high-powered gamers have been demanding more and more pixel-pushing power in our game boxes since the NES and Sega MS. Anyone remember playing Phantasy Star? Cool graphics and gameplay, but we wanted more, more!
And so we are served with the PS3. A monstrosity in pixel power bravado one can only dream of previously. And no, the Cell will not run Tiger or Leopard. Good dreamin for those imaginative few. It can be done but who will write the OS - Sony? fuhget it! They can’t even write a functional “rootkit” DRM. How about Apple? Too busy with their other hobbies. M$? Now were talking…
Anyway, if you just consider the gaming side of the PS3 then it is too damn expen$ive! Now, perhaps justifying that purchase by deducting say > $400 to buy a Blu-Ray player (initially) then you are back to $199 for the game box.
I hope the drive tray or slot for the PS3 will be as smooth as my Mac minis.
Do Toshiba or Sony really expect someone’s grandmother to know which discs to buy or which player they have? I think that will be key.-Gabe
Ditto. I can’t even tell which is -R or +R discs, let alone -RW, +RW, dual layers, and so on.
These two camps’ lead companies are just too boneheaded to even talk of “one” standard HD disc format. Then again, we have Apple and M$ in the computer space…
I went to a seminar organised by my disk supplier on HD and BD. I think that BD is going to win this one because….
1. It really is more advanced.
Imagine you are looking at a x-section of a disc.
HD-DVD consists of 2 layers, each taking up 1/2 the disk; essentially 2 normal DVDs glued together. This gives it double the capacity of a DVD, but that’s it. The limit has already been reached.
Looking at your BD x-section, draw a line 1/10th of the way down the disk. That’s single layer BD. Draw another line another 1/10th down. That’s dual layer. So, besides the fact that single layer capacity is already bigger, there is still room in the disk for more layers as manufacturing processes develop. 200GB BDs are a possibility.
2. BD-E / DVD±RW / CD-RW drives are already in production. I know HD-DVDs are backwards compatible as well, but the main perception of BD was that you would have to throw all your old disks or install 2 drives. Not true, and I can see OEMs shipping Super-Combo drives as standard on high-end stations.
3. PS3. This is a massive selling point for BD. I see the PS3 as a really cheap way to get a BD player. I use my PS2 for watching movies more than I play games anyway. The fact that I can fire up DOOM and shoot stuff is just a bonus. As long as Sony hasn’t f***ed it up, the PS3 will sell loads, whether it’s to watch BD, play old games or the latest titles. MS shafted HD-DVD when they made the HD drive a bolt on for X-Box 360. All the manufacturers know they can do the same with a BD drive as well. Ship it with a software patch and it’s done.
If I were to choose from a techie point-of-view, yes, Blu-Ray has my wallet hands down. But majority of consumers are not specifications-minded like us A.M. readers. If this is not the case then Beta should have won the 1/2” video format.
I have been hearing “problems” with the BD firmware (recent podcast on TWIT 6/21/06 w/ our man John Dvorak!) and this is delaying Sony’s launch of their stand-alone players. I hope the PS3 will not miss the holiday season or else HD-DVD is a shoe-in winner just because they have been on the market longer.
From an ordinary and unwitting HD customer, having the HD-DVD moniker is also a big plus for Toshiba. They are using the old trick called brand familiarity, in this case, trusty DVDs. BD-ROM and the Blu-Ray brands are relatively new and strange-sounding. That is why the PS3 will be an HD equation tilter to get these brands in consumers’ minds.
MS shafted HD-DVD when they made the HD drive a bolt on for X-Box 360. All the manufacturers know they can do the same with a BD drive as well. Ship it with a software patch and it’s done. -D.Ebeck
I am not aware of what you are talking about. M$ as far as I know is a devoted HD-DVD camper (at this point in the battle anyway). Can you elaborate some more?
I am not aware of what you are talking about. M$ as far as I know is a devoted HD-DVD camper (at this point in the battle anyway). Can you elaborate some more?
Sorry, slipped into conspiracy mode there, and commented on speculation as fact.
Anyway, the thoery is that MS is part of HD-DVD because they aren’t going to get into bed with Sony, their arch rival for the game industry. But the 360 also doesn’t have a HD drive fitted. They can’t release an upgraded product when HD is ready, because it will cause confusion for consumers and dilute the x-box brand. And it takes them long enough to design and ship a product that they don’t want to wait until the next upgrade round.
So, they make a bolt-on HD-DVD drive to allow HD to be played on the 360. But if they do this, then there is nothing stopping them from doing the same with a BD drive, should it look like BD is winning. Thus M$’ stance in the HD-DVD camp is currently all talk (as is Apple’s).
Until a company actually has a product with one format or the other, their blusterings don’t actually count for anything.
But the 360 also doesn’t have a HD drive fitted -D. Ebeck
Yeah it’s all speculation about Sony vs M$ on the X360. But, we know why the X360 did not pack an HD-DVD drive even when M$ wanted to. It was not ready and Robbie Batch’s rear-end was locked-n-loaded so he had no choice but bolt a standard DVD mechanism since ye ol’ reliable DVD format is just as capable of handling HD media, meaning a DVD disc can accomodate a 1080p programming just as good as HD-DVD discs. It is only less storage space. Now we got that.
As for M$ devotion to the HD-DVD camp is surely for marketing purposes only and I do doubt their faithfulness to the cause.
Regarding the “bolt-on” external HD-DVD drive, that is completely unneeded. They can just come up with another config of the X360 that has this HD-DVD. M$ has to be leaning more on the HD-DVD since their current crop of games are encoded on a DVD format. Having HD-DVD gives the capability to hybridize both a standard DVD and/or HD format on one disc. That is currently not permitted on a BD drive unless BD camp gets a blessing from the DVD Forum and that is a cardinal sin for Sony.
Hybrid drives are available. Panasonic have produced cross format drives already. I don’t think that it is possible to mix red laser SD / blue laser HD on the same disc, as that would require the laser to change frequencies in mid-play. You could certainly have a HD or BD disc that included SD content. You’d fit the entire SW saga on one disc….
I don’t think that it is possible to mix red laser SD / blue laser HD on the same disc, as that would require the laser to change frequencies in mid-play -D.Ebeck
Dan, from an engineer’s point-of-view nothing is impossible especially on matters concerning junction diode LED lasers, ok? Trust me it can be done and a dual-junction LED laser that supports 650nm and 405nm wavelengths at the same time on a piece of silicon about the size of the tip of a pencil is already available for consumption.
HD-DVD takes advantage of this to better degree than BD. What I meant with the hybrid disc was the multi-layer capability of HD-DVD. To have a standard DVD (or SD content) one layer is assigned as the regular DVD format. This would be read by the 650nm red laser. Layers two and/or three would be the identical programming but in the hi-def HD-DVD format. Then that would be read by the 405nm blue-violet laser. Simple?
No, you can’t mix standard DVD/HD-DVD content on any one layer at the same time. You are right about switching red and blue lasers mid-point in the content. That does not make sense in any engineering vocabulary. What are you trying to accomplish with that?
As for Panasonic releasing a hybrid HD-DVD & Blu-Ray drives are not correct. At this point, Sony nor Toshiba will allow either party to combine the two formats into a single drive mechanism. What you are referring to is the BD drive’s capability to “backward” support older DVD discs. Blu-Ray format can’t combine BD & DVD on one disc (note the difference here folks!). In BD you either play old DVD or buy newer BDs plain and simple.
The ability of HD-DVD to combine DVD and HD-DVD content in ONE disc is the feature that would make HD-DVD the choice of content providers and disc manufacturers and duplicators. All of which will not require a complete dismantle of their factories just to support HD format. BD will require all these infrastructure dismantle and expensive capital expenditures.
I said I don’t care who wins in the end but considering that I just want to watch quality hi-def movies at fair cost, who exactly would be providing that? The expensive Blu-Ray or the tried & true and inexpensive DVD/HD-DVD?